The WPBSA has changed the ranking points tariff for next season.
The two Chinese events are now worth 7,000 points apiece to the winners, as opposed to 5,000 last season.
The World Championship is once again worth 10,000 points and the UK Championship 8,000.
Winning the Grand Prix will net 7,000 points - up 750 on last season.
The Welsh Open is now well and truly the poor relation on the circuit, worth 5,000 to the eventual champion.
As two ranking tournaments have been axed, it seems sensible to up the tariffs bearing in mind the rankings are worked out over two seasons.
59 comments:
Another absurdity.
The World Championship has always had double, or almost double, points, which is at it should be.
And why is the Welsh Open worth less points than other equivalent events? What possible reason is there?
Is anyone actually putting any thought into running the sport? Pathetic.
I think the point is that if there are two fewer tournaments then the total number of points has to rise to balance out the list between the two seasons.
Well I think it's sensible to reinforce the prestige of Chinese events. Expansion out of UK will be crucial for the survival of snooker. It will ensure the top boys take it seriously.
Aligning the GP with them is ok as well. Nothing justified it to be worth 1500 more than other "normal" events.
Not increasing the weight of the WC is sensible aswell: with only 6 tournaments and no changes it would very much have been all about it with the danger of some players only concentrating on that one (at their own risk of course).
Now if they could add an European ranker with worthy points, I would be happy.
(dream on girl!)
Indeed, the Welsh Open looks doomed to failure and should probably be scraped as a ranking event.
Best of 9 frame tournaments are a bit of a lottery. Last years semi-finalists were Hamilton/Swail/Carter/Robertson.
Tennis grand slams are over the best of 5 sets. Snooker should follow this and play ranking events over a longer duration.
"The World Championship has always had double, or almost double, points, which is at it should be."
Why? The sport should be expanding, not having one event dominate the season.
a backhand way of making players turn up to Chinese events perhaps?
the point is the Welsh Open has more tradition and history going back to 1992 unbroken i think it rates above the shanghai masters whitch has a 2 year history.
giving a higher Ranking status because its in china and the country is in the middle of a snooker boom is wrong and a bit biased.
Status should be installed on history and tradition of a event.
As the Welsh Open is my, sort of, local tournament I feel it does effectively make the event seem somewhat worthless in comparison to the others. Could they not have levelled things out a bit across the board. I get the feeling the players are going through the motions a bit in Wales anyway without this development.
It does seem a little odd that the Welsh Open is looked down upon somewhat. The crowds it attracts always seem to be good compared to some of the other events. It would make more sense to have all the events at the same level and then a lot more points for the World. I mean, why should the winner of the China Open be worth more than the winner of the Welsh? It doesn't make much sense to me.
What's happened to the Bahrain event? And there was talk of resurrecting the ranking event in Malta? If sponsors aren't interested in keeping these events going what chance have we of getting sponsors for the events in the UK? Maybe for next season we'll have the 'BBC UK Championship', the 'BBC Grand Prix' and the 'BBC Welsh Open'.
Hmm, not too sure I like those changes. I agree that the total needed to be brought up but when the World Championship matches are played over 35, 33, 25 and 19 frames, I believe that the tournament deserves to carry double points compared to the 'lesser' events because it requires such a great effort to win it.
Shame to see the Welsh devalued too, particularly given the good crowds pulled in this year and the history as has been mentioned.
Heard rumors that the Welsh Open was in trouble this season and might not be run.
Found it hard to believe but this is a funny development that could back that up.
Maybe it will be downgraded somehow if the sponsors or venue is not there.
Hopefully not, with the scottish, Irish and Northern Irish events gone it would be a shame to lose the welsh also.
you can please some of the people some of the time etc etc etc. but you will always have the mal-contents.
We are certainly not short of venues, nor very keen and knowledgable spectators in Wales.
The event has run unbroken since 1992, when it replaced the previous long running Welsh Professional Championship.
But if the Welsh Open is given the lowest status of all the ranking events then there isn't a snowball in hell's chance of attracting a sponsor.
The snooker scene in Wales remains buoyant, both at the grass roots participation base, through the WBSA at junior and senior level, and through our Coaching Foundation,
We more than hold our own in major international events and on the professional stage, despite being a very small population base. Sadly the sheep are reluctant to take up the sport!
Pretty shabby treatment for Wales
CYMRU AM BYTH
Janie (extremely pissed off Welsh witch!)
Interestingly last season's Welsh final was one of the best attended of the whole season
the whole event was well atended.. why ill tell you why the publicity the Welsh Open had from the Welsh Media was better than what british media gave the UK Championship.
you have to put in the work to atract the people and wales does it extreamly well...pity BBC Wales droped Clive and kept John Evans apart from that it was a success.
Shame if the Welsh Open is axed. The prize money is OK considering there's no TV coverage or sponsor.
It's sad to watch our once great sport slip into the abyss.
Darts is currently doing rather well in Wales, though.
It's deckchairs on the Titanic I'm afraid. The real issue is how many ranking events there are, not how many points they award (though that's not irrelevant). Also the 'non-ranking' events announced the other day are another joke. Why not make them ranking? And, why in God's name, have yet another tournament in bloody Prestatyn? It's supposed to be a professional CIRCUIT.
I doubt there's any sport in the world as critically ill as snooker. The entire game needs a mega overhaul from someone like Barry Hearn, but, tragically, the people running it are straight out of Jurassic Park!
Maybe Ronnie will have to go to China now.
Could be clever on the part of WSA.
An oxymoron I know.
i dont see what that has to do with ranking points though dave?
i do think the gap between the Worlds and the other tournaments was 2 big.....
you could say Stephen Hendrys carear is hanging on his World Championship results....
Rankings should reward consistancy...
Stephen Hendry 11th most consistant player in 2008/2009 ? come on he lost 4 first rounders and made that up with a World Quarter.....
but demoting the welsh open is not on.
If the rumours on here and elsewhere are true they'll be splitting the points available last season between just 4 events this coming season.
This is a very worrying time for snooker and I truly fear for it. I constantly hear about how our sport is growing in Europe, but not one sponsor seems to be approaching the WSA to set up an event.
Does anyone know why?
Personally I see the China Open as one of the more prestigious events on the calendar and one with room for expansion to the UK best of 17 format in the future.
The Shanghai is secondary but I'm pleased the China Open has had ranking points upped because it's a great event and one I always look forward to.
That might be because it was cheap and what else do they get in that part of the world?
Anon 6:41pm the welsh open is televised on bbc wales.
and eurosport as is all other Ranking Tournaments
There are a lot of snooker "heartlands" that can still be exploited. The Republic of Ireland has got no event, Southern England doesn't have a ranking event, and why were Malta and Northern Ireland dropped from the calendar - did the WSA not have the funding and/or sponsorship?
Also, the WSA needs some new ranking events. Germany is a no-brainer - enthusiastic fans, potential for a wildcard round (Munstermann, Santos, Lippe, Figueredo for example), or if Einsle gets on tour his matches can be held over to the venue.
Hopefully Thepchaiya Un-Nooh can spark some interest in Thailand, and I'd also try to get something started in Belgium - you could again have a wildcard round with Haneveer and Brecel, possibly along with some Dutch players like Roy Stolk.
I'd also try to give the PIOS series a major shake-up - 8 events at Prestatyn with nobody watching won't attract even the tiniest sponsor. Have 1 or 2 events at Pontin's, but spread the rest around the World Snooker Academy, the Masters qualifying venue (RAC Club?) - if the chance is there, take the events overseas to give local players more of a chance to get good competitive snooker - not everybody can shell out the money needed for the PIOS as it stands now for little or no reward.
All that comment, and not even one mention of the Fine Mess Method, so on that note...
Actually, maybe I shouldn't go there.
John of the Fine Mess Method
All constructive comments from John of the Fine Mess Method - you're not Higgins are you with the Stan Laurel reference?
One thing I would add is that the sport would benefit greatly from internet coverage, particularly the PIOS and the final rounds of the ranking qualifiers. This would generate a great deal of betting interest, which would in turn generate interest from sponsors. I just don't understand the reluctance or resistence to go down this road. Potentially a huge audience globally with just that bit of investment. It could get snooker back on it's feet again.
Sorry to hark back to the Welsh Open, but it's my understanding from a senior director within the company, that Valiant Sports was approached by the WPBSA asking what price they'd be prepared to pay to sponsor both The Masters and Welsh Open.
Given that they'd recently made 200 redundant and closed 30 snooker clubs, they said that the funds simply weren't there.
I understand that no assurance of TV coverage could be given for the Welsh Open.
They declined their offer.
The Welsh Open hasn't been sponsored for six years but has still been staged.
If there's a TV contract to show it (which there is), it will go ahead.
Anon @ 9:35
Betting interest on low ranked PIOS events and qualifiers would not generate any significant betting interest as the sport is tainted with on-going investigations. Bookmakers just wouldn't offer any odds as the temptation to throw a match is just too great. Sorry to bring up a tennis analogy again, but the events below main tour level (Challengers/ITF) are very rarely priced up by any bookmakers, and if they are you will not be able to get a significant bet on them.
I agree that two competitor sports such as tennis, snooker and darts do offer excellent betting mediums, but at the lower levels of these professional competitions the threat of match fixing is just too great for it to be worthwhile for bookmakers to price them up.
It's more about what stations and coverage is on offer, Dave.
Broadcasting solely on BBC Wales is not the sort of contract that's conducive to a national sponsor. How many viewers outside of Wales can watch it?
The assurances that couldn't be given hinged on BBCi coverage.
The rumours that are doing the rounds that the Welsh Open is being axed aren't without substance. An exclusive TV contract with a regional BBC network (Wales) isn't what the game needs right now. It's both national AND international coverage in emerging markets.
That's also why sponsors are reluctant to get involved.
It's on Eurosport as well.
All I can say is that I haven't heard that the Welsh Open is in doubt.
Time, as ever, will tell.
what a stupid arguament its not natinality..
incase people dont know Wales is a different country to England the same as china is.
eurosport brings in covarage from china to britain the same way they bring in covarage from wales.
The Welsh Open is on BBC Wales (which is also available to any sky subscriber, selecting BBC Wales instead of BBC London or wherever).
It's also on Eurosport and in turn will get picked up by the Chinese tv etc.
And of course it would be rocket science to set up live streaming of these events in association with the broadcast partner - and streaming that is available to the whole world and not (I'm sorry you're not in the UK - BBC steams)
Re. Ireland. Another country with a very buoyant snooker scene, both as players and spectators.
At this moment I am sitting in the brand spanking new 12 table RIBSA Academy, the NEW Ivy Rooms in Carlow.
It's an excellent facility, 12 Wiraka M1 match tables, match cloths, proper lighting rigs (no frilly frayed lampshades here!)
All the players are thoroughly looking forward to competing the Celtic Challenge here this weekend (yes it's on Global Snooker all weekend - plug!)
Ireland, regardless of being overlooked by WSA, have two major events planned in the coming season. The Huge popular pro/invite event in Killarney is pencilled in and (still to be confirmed) I'm told the World Series will also be back in Ireland, and that might even be the Grand Finals weekend.
Another country overlooked - Malta. The very forward looking new administration of snooker in Malta has invested in the future of snooker there, buying up all the match tables out of Pontin's, previously used by WSA. First of all they'll use them to stage the European Team championships and the European Under 19 championships next March (a real treat for the players) and then the tables will go into a brand new Malta Snooker Academy, being set up.
Academies are flavour of the month. They're springing up all over Europe, and even in the UK. As well as the WSA Academy, there is already LIASE in Liverpool and another Academy dedicated to top practice and match facilities has just received planning permission in England.
People may run down Pontin's, but without those superb snooker conditions for the past few years, WSA and other organisers would have been sadly short of top quality match conditions to stage events.
WSA would have incurred far higher costs for their qualifiers if they'd had to go and rig tables at various venues and incur hotel costs etc for their officials.
While we're on about tables. (Which we weren't!) I've been told today (and I stress I haven't had this verified) that Top WSA players in the rankings are being offered a discount to buy themselves one of the new Star tables, but that this season's new intake of pros are having to shell out full price.
If that is true then it's outrageous. Give a discount to those that can afford a table anyway and charge those that can't. The game isn't only divided by ranking points for those top or bottom of the system.
sorry Dave. Another long rant. I'll go and check the dosage on my chill pills!!
Looking at the comments over several months on here and all I read is that snooker, especially in Europe, is growing/is buoyant/has lots of potential/is an untapped market.
If that's the case then don't you think we would have companies queueing up to get involved? There have been opportunities for several years now to have an event named after a title sponsor, yet the number of ranking events is slowly decreasing.
We've got to face up to the reality that there are no companies looking to sponsor snooker tournaments either in the UK or elsewhere. This was true before the worldwide recession kicked in, and it will be true when it's over - albeit, I fear, with less ranking events than we have for next season.
Maybe it's time to have most of the tournaments in the far East. The perception in the UK is that snooker has had it's time in the spotlight, which can be demonstrated by the fact that even the BBC events struggle for sponsors - Betfred stepped in late for the WC, the Masters is unsponsored, the Welsh Open has had no sponsor for years, and there are still doubts over the UK. No new sponsor is going to sponsor a 'new event' when those receiving quite extensive TV coverage can't attract sponsorship.
I hope this can get TV coverage, about time their was a Seniors event:
http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/sport/4468470.Big_break_for_Bradford_snooker/
Anon @ 12:45pm
That looks excellent! It will be great to see the old boys in action again, especially Higgins. I'd bet this event will be more popular than many of the ranking events. No disrespect to many of today's players, but you wouldn't recognise them is they sat next to you on a plane. These elder statesmen are instantly recognisable - they all have something about them that sets them apart from today's breed of automatons.
Encouraging to see that the veterans event is positive about getting a sponsor.
Makes you wonder WTF Sir Rodney and his bunch of hangers-on get up to.
Well done Joe Johnson. The roll of President of the WPBSA shuld be yours!!
Will Wales have a sponsor this year?
Did it have one last year?
BBC Wales cover it. So what.
Nothing else happens in Wales so they've got a stash of cash for local projects.
Face up. Wales is cheap to stage, the local broadcaster will always cover it, and the vast majority of players can drive there.
wales has better crowds they are more passionate for the sport if nothing happens in wales as you put it then where better to have a tournament because people might aswell go there better than counting sheep.
If "wales has better crowds" and "they are more passionate for the sport", then how come at last year's Premier League meeting in Newport the crowds were asked to all move down to the front to make it look like the venue was full for the Sky cameras?
prem league is micky mouse.
If "wales has better crowds" and "they are more passionate for the sport", then how come at last year's Premier League meeting in Newport the crowds were asked to all move down to the front to make it look like the venue was full for the Sky cameras?
because Barry would have charged more than world snooker
If people are flagging up the Welsh Open and Wales as a glorious example of snooker currently, then God help us!
It would be interesting to see attendance figures for the Welsh Open over the last 10-15 years. Same with the TV viewing figures.
The authorities must be fully aware of them and it would be the first question any prospective sponsor would ask.
Maybe this is why boom sports such as darts have capacity attendances at all/most events and wall-to-wall TV coverage, that they are subsequently able to attract big name sponsorship.
atendancies for the Welsh Open was better than for the UK Championship by a country mile.
Why is there nothing on the World Snooker website about this change to the ranking points allocation? Surely they need to explain why the Welsh Open is only worth 5,000 points don't they? There must be a reson for it so just tell us and then we won't have to speculate about it. They need to learn how to communicate!
The info actually is on WPBSA site. Only not at the most visible place and they still use MS-Word to publish their infos in docs. When will they learn about openess and the existence of PDF?
Other than that I certainly don't think most event should be staged in Asia. The audience isn't that great there despite all the hype, most probably because the price of tixes is extremely high for the average chinese worker. If the game is to expand I'd try one ranker in Germany for a start.
Last season's UK Championship was packed out, unlike the Welsh Open. don't believe everything people write on this blog.
the Welsh Open is more prestigous than the shanghai masters and has history in the shaping of the game...
Mark Williams First Title
Paul Hunter First Title
Paul Hunter became the youngest ever Semi Finalist
The only Ranking Event Ronnie O'Sullivan has succesfully defended.
Steve Davis 28th and final Ranking Win
it is a tournament with a almost 20 years unbroken history and was around before the likes of Ronnie,John Higgins and Mark Williams even turned profesional and now its worth 2,000 less ranking points to the winner in winning same number of frames as winners in china......how **** idiotic.
There surely can be no justification for the Grand Prix and Chinese events having a points tarif 40% higher than the Welsh which has an identical format played over the same number of frames.
There should be a bigger differential (now only 14%)between the UK and the others as it is played over besy nof 17 frame matches. That could mean giving even more to the World but I think that making the Chinese and GP say 6,000 to the winner would have given just about the right balance.
This further de-values the Welsh Open in my opinion, it should be held in the same regard as the Grand Prix, and two Chinese events. the only events with a larger tariff should be the longer frame tournaments - The UK and Worlds.
I would also stake a claim for a move to a one-year list as World Snooker do not seem able to keep the number of ranking events constant from year-to-year, this would also see more movement in the rankings as the top 16 would not be so protected.
Anonymous said...
Last season's UK Championship was packed out, unlike the Welsh Open. don't believe everything people write on this blog.
yes the UK arena was well attended but it was a small "purpose-built" arena which didn't actually hold that many people.
I sit in the photographers seats at all events and get a very good view of the "empty seats" which I try hard to not get in the background of photos.
The Welsh, the UK and the World all had good attendances, and I may be wrong, but I think the capacity of the Newport centre was larger than either Telford or the UK.
In the early stages in the Welsh play was across 4 tables so the crowd was a bit spread but for the quarters onwards it was jammed packed.
" Anonymous said...
Last season's UK Championship was packed out, unlike the Welsh Open. don't believe everything people write on this blog"
we dont thats why we take no notice of what you said.
i take notice of what ive seen and theres better promotion and atendance at the Welsh Open in Newport than the UK Championship in Telford.
The Welsh Open is only shown on regional TV, that's why it gets lower ranking points. If it was shown over all of England instead of just one part of it then maybe it will get some ranking points back.
i disagree 5-10
6-35, theres more to the world than england
scotland has done better in snookers top ranking event in the last 20 years....
6.35pm
the china open is shown only in china via Theire own TV Production but like the Welsh Open Eurosport shows that in europe and england.
whats the difference ??
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